How do you monetize followers?.

all right so our intro is a pretty short and sharp yeah so what I'm going to do is just hand over to you and you tell us a little bit about who you are where you come from yeah I'm Josh I'm Joshua Singh born brought up in New Zealand um studied here all my life you know traveled a bit in uh across those years as well to different countries um started a Instagram brand when it first you know when the platform first came up yeah and really focused on faith as as my Avenue because that's the environment I grew up in I grew up in a church environment my dad took pasta so yeah they work pretty well um then obviously I studied the university

and a bachelor of information systems and marketing um and you know went into different corporate Fields like Vodafone and Office Max and and now um at Air New Zealand and along the way I would say that I've I've discovered or evolved as a person right and in every season there's a different version of you that you get to discover yeah and so for me um I think I was initially I was very very outspoken in the faith place and on Instagram I built that and then LinkedIn came out I started tapping into that you know YouTube's still there I mean I try to like get like get across everything because I know the future of marketing is going to be personal branding rights yeah yeah

that's a bit about me I don't know if I should I don't know what else to say about me man that's him I'm gonna dig into it because there's a few things that like the saying that just came up there that I want to ask about why do you think it's important for you to say you're New Zealand born that's really interesting question because I think a lot of people think I'm just born and brought up in India flew over Farm as a migrant family but you know my dad well it was a migrant he came to the country when it's like in 89 or 90. um and then you know I was born here um in in I grew up in South Auckland yeah

I know you've been mangreneur I know you did and and I grew up with you know a range of different um people and and I saw what life was you know um and I remember my dad like you know doing the hard yard so yeah I think it's important to note that I am kiwi yeah and I love being a kiwi do you feel like you have to tell people that is that saying that's often no I'm not sure I think my accent kind of pulls it like tells people like yeah and also like I'm quite for thinking in terms of like I don't think like her yeah I don't think in the cultural norms yeah yeah yeah because I think that is something that's

quite interesting about you is that like you are this walking contradiction sometimes that's interesting well yeah you take your last name right yeah it's a religious last name but it's not the religion that you're you practice yeah or the faith that you practice there we go the faith that you um and there's a lot of things that in that and even the faith that you do practice because it's like Christian or yeah Christian um how many things belong to the Christian faith right 100 and so I think that's also something that probably like how often do you have to justify your positions in place or do you just not give a crap ah actually I don't really have too many people asking me that question

no no no no that's not that I think I don't think people dive too much yeah yeah into the the deeper story I think people um probably see what I do and they interact me interact with me based on that level yeah so what is the story how is it that sings yeah a part of a big part like you're dead it's his church right yeah yeah my dad's side of the church like what 20 25 years yeah yeah right tell me that story so he was uh he was a Machinery he left home at 16 and he started um he he was involved with the local Mission and then he um left Australia got involved with the church there as a missionary and traveled

all around the ocean Ocean Pacific right then landed up in New Zealand to start his um his ministry they would call it yeah and he he worked with the Indian Community because he knew the pains and the needs and he was one of the first Indian churches here so predominantly I come out from an ethnic background Church you you would say it's not a multicultural church as such but now I'm faced with the with the challenge of working with you know a second generation of kiwis or Indian kiwis yeah and we're walking with them through the Fate so it's really interesting yeah um that's a journey all that that's a whole conversation man that's a huge one though yeah the reason why I like I

press on it and the reason I wanted to talk to you about the fake stuff today is because as a brand it's it's a it's a you know there's three things that I always say to clients that are weary things to talk about in terms of content yeah and that is money politics and religion correct and you built a brand on faith almost exclusively yeah up until what about three years ago or so right yeah when you started doing LinkedIn stuff which you sort of separated correct and that was a big challenge I must say yeah because for me I I was I was my identity yeah was deeply rooted in that right and so I was re that was my scope that was my

gig I could talk about I still can't talk about it yeah you get me on a church platform to hold it back but I could preach yeah right but you get me on LinkedIn talking about business it was out of my comfort zone yeah but I had to dive into the gift set because I don't think gifts um and as much as they can be scoped or categorized I think your gift set can be used to lies in multiple platforms yeah and so let's talk about that first of all Instagram yeah and the faith um audience that you built there what was the goal um the goal was to get as much as content and again but to be honest yeah let's get as many

followers as we can because when Instagram started I was all about followers yeah yeah I was like let's just get like 10 000 followers or 15 000 followers and like that was a goal yeah um obviously I noticed As I Grew followers dropped off but a lot of my followers have stayed across across the across the game yeah um and and there that they are evolving as well as much as I am so it's quite interesting what are you sitting at now follow oh six thousand six thousand five hundred and what's that Journey being like recently like it's slowed down yeah I've got to be honest with you slow down probably because of the algorithm yeah stuffing me up but anyways um I think what

I've learned in the midst of it all is finding your Rhythm to just post yeah and not not measure yourself with metrics yeah because in the beginning I measured myself with metrics right yeah and my self-identity or my self-esteem was based on yeah how good I was doing with numbers how many views how many likes how many comments I was getting yeah but I think you get to a point in your life you're just like no don't care just keep just keep doing it yeah people respect consistency man yeah yeah for sure and have you like is your community pretty strong on that platform like there are a lot of people who are part of that yeah correct yeah is that my community right now

is locally uh local right Global and local right but I find there is a much what much more massive reach in in India if I tapped into it yeah yeah um if I tapped into Dubai or the southern uh like the Middle Eastern countries there's a lot of faith-based people there that I haven't even adapted to yet yeah neither have I done any like marketing right yeah yeah oh here we are here yeah and have you um as you've sort of evolved this brand um because because your content's like pretty well produced too it always has been yeah I've got a got a good yeah group of guys out here yeah they'll always back me up is it so are these like guys from your

church and stuff yeah yeah so they'll help and you're 100 um and so now what is the goal um that is a question that I'm trying to figure that's a really good question because I don't have a direct answer to that yeah yeah right um I think at this age and stage in my life I'm trying to figure out how I can cross collaborate my platforms and also look into long-term monetization yeah yeah yeah yeah and for me I'm always I've always had the bass for you like how can you monetize Faith right like I mean I could do courses but like what's the premium on a course you know what I mean and like it's scalable courses are scalable but is it really engaging

is it life-changing you know you know yeah I could create a funnel but it's all short term right yeah yeah yeah so yeah that's where I'm at I'm trying to figure out where that is why do you think because you've like limped into this Faith stuff on here do you pull punches like do you lean right into the faith hard on here like I because like I'll tell you why it's like I'm not you know your content doesn't resonate with me I'm here so I don't watch a lot of it but like in terms of I probably watch your stories more than I watch anything else but in terms of your content like do is it strong enough of an opinion that people really get

behind or are you quite reserved and you approach there yeah I've probably taken a scented approach yeah um because I don't want to start any awards yet yeah yeah yeah yeah because um with the war you need to be ammo'd up right yeah yeah and um and you've got to have the time to respond to people right it's it's I could just bomb the place yeah and put really like really crazy truths out there but if it's misinterpreted which is the world we live in now everything's misinterpreted everybody is a subjective view then I'm gonna have to respond or my my the brand value degrades long term yeah yeah so I'm just I'm actually trying to figure there are some stuff I could say yeah

from a Biblical perspective that will not resonate with certain people that are following me yeah and they could be like hey what are you up to you know yeah comments could start and then people start sharing that stuff and you could blow up but I could capitalize on that too yeah yeah yeah and I feel like it's one of those things right in faith-based stuff is that there's a fine line between like do you just become a digital church or are you actually offering some other value to people because you've got a church yeah so when I mean digital church is that there are almost scammer-like people out there using Faith as a way to yeah scam people in a digital Church sort of thing

you don't want to be that person probably well I'm guessing maybe I don't know if you don't want to be that guy no way man but that's kind of that's the sphere right that you can then become like um game digital Church guy which there is a lot of them out there and so for you you think monetizing this is a way of like offering some form of like uh coaching or yeah coaching is definitely a way of monetization I've tried that that works a bit um I think I still need to be more stronger in the content side of things if I need to like make that a kind of bread and butter but I've never really dived into it because coaching is a

um you're still giving away time yeah for money yeah and I don't see I don't see I want the brand to bring in the revenue rather than me selling my time yeah I'm just trying to think out of the box here yeah um when you said digital at churches that was quite interesting because I do think a lot of where the world is going is like communities are becoming way more hybrid and very official right so there's a way to do it eh yeah and and when we say pastoral care that's essentially a church term for coaching yeah yeah or spiritual culture or you know caretaking for people and really the elements of pastoral care is when you come to church you're loving people helping

people you're journeying with people and you're making them feel like they can grow in their fate right and you use the Bible and you use prayer in different mechanisms to grow that so digitally that'll be quite interesting but I do see a space coming up in the future yeah cool um is it just saying that you're sort of got on the back burner for now back burner because you've focused on Career yeah yeah back burner right yeah just because when coming up with content yeah no like I'm finding myself if I don't read if I don't take myself to the edge of the cliff I'm still going to be repeating myself from 2012 you know yeah yeah yeah and talk to me last question about

the stuff yeah Community yeah where does your community are you building one have you been building one does it hang out anywhere other than your profile um yeah so iclcnz which is a tag right that's the community I'm trying to link people to yep so that's the in-person church that's your dad's church and I run the kind of young adults kind of married couples kind of space in there um that's uh that would be my leeway yeah into the brands the Brand's opening another door to another brand new does that make sense yeah okay yeah um and what do we got here link tree and I use this actually I use Revelation websites as a really good opportunity to create a network of affiliate yeah

yeah okay yeah and that's part of what I'm part of my vision was five six years ago is to actually help churches with the digital marketing and the personal branding now it's becoming more branding for the pastors and the preachers and the ministers yeah because that's a big Avenue there but um we would probably be one of the ex one of the only exclusive agencies in New Zealand yeah okay yeah yeah that do what we do yeah nice and how's that going is that still going fairly strong yeah pretty good so that's run now by um a colleague of mine okay I'm just a shareholder but um we started that focusing on just doing graphic artworks um social media management you know yeah all that

kind of all that kind of jazz yeah go go go all right so talk to me so then we met about three years ago yeah which was very interesting I don't know how I think he Linked In Me yeah yeah I definitely would have messaged you on LinkedIn um and I mean I was going through a stage of like finding Community here in New Zealand because I'd only adjust my background like I think we first met in 2019 yeah and when I first met you you're only really just getting onto LinkedIn a bit more then yeah uh I think about 1500 yeah connections yeah and you're really only just starting to utilize it as a platform so tell me because we talked about this a

few times in the past it's like where does that Faith finish and where does your career start and you struggled with that at first because I remember you've asked me a few times like how much we should we should that line finish yeah I think the struggle was do I put fake content on LinkedIn yeah one yeah two is it relevant number three I'm trying to get through you know business transactions here and grow Revenue yeah but I don't see Faith as the doorway to do it yep so I try to dabble through like leadership and like different different topics like that are relevant to where I've been founded upon and try to tackle that and I think this opportunity here but my still my

concern to this day is yeah am I pivot am I am I dividing the tension of my my follower yeah to be confused about who I really am yeah yeah yeah and that that's the question I still have for you yeah yeah what do you think well I think on your LinkedIn stuff I've said there's still one view once before do you like do you really care what people think about you which most of the time these days I think your answer is no yeah I think maybe a few years ago it wasn't no so much yeah I agree but I think these days it's definitely a no yep so then [ __ ] it like yeah just do it because like another thing about it like

look at the thing about you know our mutual contact and friend Murray yeah like that business relationship was strengthened because of Faith just because like I don't you know it doesn't resonate with me or there are you know in New Zealand business Community is quite a secular Community already so there's going to be a lot of people who um it doesn't resonate with yeah as long as it's not shoving it down their throat yeah as in like if you don't do this yeah as long as it's there I don't think I think there's sort of space for it I think people can still be it it still shows a little level of person that you are yeah and there's plenty of people who are very

like heavy in their beliefs yeah I agree um in the business world and it's untapped day okay well it's not it's not done very much on you mean content hasn't been produced to Target the network okay good point I'll take that on board man yeah I will take that on board because you only need like okay one we probably need to talk about how are you going to then monetize that because that's a different question because then that will influence the way you do things but like let's say you're selling agency services like me right let's say you're a marketing agency you only need 20 of those people correct to have a really successful business great so who cares about the over 70 000 yeah

yeah makes sense doesn't really matter right yeah and I think that people get like really confused about that like they're like oh I want everyone to love me it's like well everyone's not going to give you money so yeah 100 and and what's interesting is like you said you keep using the word monetization the problem is in the infrastructure of my brain yeah capacity yeah I don't think monetization first yeah right I think monetization lasts yeah but what you're trying to I think you're trying to inspire me to think is let's get if you know where you're going with this yeah you just work backwards exactly well that's a good point for me it's always monetization first yeah because you don't need to be on

social media at all and so why are you there and for some people it's just vanity and that's fine if that's what you want go for it like you're not going to judge you for wanting to actually go for it but I've I've known you over the last three years money is a real big driver for you and like not just money because you want lots of money but like the success in career yeah as well and money is obviously a byproduct of that and that's one reason why you've been more heavy into LinkedIn so then it's like well don't beat around the bush like what's the point like why are we here yeah like if we're here to monetize you know let's start there

yeah because sometimes what I find happens if you don't do that you become those scammy churches I talked about yeah because you're like oh I really need to turn a buck now yeah and the easiest way to turn a buck is do the dodgy [ __ ] yeah or like sell people crap yeah um you know I don't know if you saw our video about the merch thing that we did last week not yet but I've I've heard you've done it and it was a mistake right like I didn't really want people to buy it but I wanted to see the data and what would come back from it but like we made it out to be as [ __ ] as possible yeah because like everyone else does

this merch and they're all like oh look how cool my merch is it's really good stuff and it's not none of it's ever good yeah ours was terrible when we charge an outrageous amount of money for it because I actually didn't want people to buy it but like that's the scammy way of doing it yeah um for us it's like what's some real value you can do so let's start there like so it's really in best time to think like how do we monetize this long term correct and then we'll work out the um the content that drives that audience there right and build a whole plan around that right um so for me it's always monetization first right and the word monetization is a

weird one yeah I don't think it's quite can you define it right or for me it's taking um how do you take this audience that you have and generate a revenue from them okay yeah and uh for a lot of people when they think of monetization they think of all the scammy ones they think of marriage they think of brand Deals they think of ads click funnels and all that sort of [ __ ] yeah and for me it's like well I get it you can make money doing that that's not a problem but you're not really adding anything to the correct to this economy or um this business world you just like skimming off the top 100 you're not really helping with anything 100 so for

our thing like we obviously are doing marketing yeah and look you could probably think of marking as a bit of [ __ ] industry itself because we do it everyone needs to do it correct you know like things still sold back in the day before Mad Men came around but um but look we do provide value we do help produce some stuff and I think that they're you're offering you're offering something that is of more value now that doesn't mean that you can't make merch that's very valuable like I bought business brand I watch on YouTube called LTT Linus Tech tips yeah and I bought their bag and their screwdriver that they've released recently because they watched their Journey for three years of them building these products

right and how perfect they got each element of it wow they spend Millions like getting oh I don't know but there's been a shitload of money yeah getting these products perfectly right right because they didn't want to just put out [ __ ] and so I'm I'm bought into that story they've officers they've bought something of value yeah rather than just like how long have you been born through for three years or longer than that I've been watching them yeah yeah three or three years yeah so you from day one and you've been consistently following them I mean they've been going longer I've been probably watching them for six years right but they've been building this product for the last three years right right and I've been

watching them do it and all the things that they're going through right so you're heavily emotionally invested man that's good man on like day one of sales of the bag they sold something like 30 000 units that this is going to be normal yeah 400 a bag how far this is going to be the norm yeah I'm telling you stories um because you felt you probably felt you were the center of the story yeah 100 you know what I mean yeah so I Justified it to him clear 100 100 so my question is let's let's be active here yes on the spot thinking stands thinking give me a blueprint yeah of how you would monetize a unique craft like unique brain like mine faith in

on LinkedIn on LinkedIn yeah well the thing with you on LinkedIn is that and and I wanted to give into this is that there's not been a direction correct like you've not stood for anything really yes 100 and most of that's come down do because like you said it yourself you've been discovering who Josh is yeah what's that career path you're taking yeah so I think for me if I was looking at you we'll sit down and go okay what does Josh need to do and be like well what what is the value you're going to offer people yeah what is that and then just in a general direction too like inspiring people to live out their faith okay let's just say that's the direction

okay so what does that mean okay that just means that every day in your workplaces in your places of influence in your decision making in your Networks you're adding value and you're living the ways of Christ which was there okay so that becomes something so you've got to then think of like how do I package that up to sell it and there's a couple ways right you can have Mastermind sort of mentor groups that are like Community Based peer subscription be part of a community um there is one-on-one Consulting coaching yep style level stuff or depending on the organization which to be honest would be very limited people is like a um uh workshop level coaching Consulting sort of stuff right yeah where you go

on for a workshop you run a workshop with the team and you're working through a set of guiding principles that helps them do what they do yeah and Faith that's going to be real hard you're going to have a smaller audiences so it probably leaves you with the other two yeah now the the fourth one which is just a pure digital product yeah base one the problem with digital product based one is that like for me they are the easy way out like what do you mean by that uh they're like the cheap scammy one right okay no value no value okay because you know you can look at it when you watch like there's that usage statistics of like a skillshare and different places

like that on online courses and how many people actually finish a course yeah how many people start one buy one and actually use it and it's little to no people for each courses so there's something that people think oh this is the answer to all my problems I'm going to buy this online course yeah and then it does nothing yeah so you're not really providing any value because nothing gets done with it yeah correct you just make lots of money yeah um you can still do it if your end goals just like make lots of money then yeah fine go for it yeah but like yeah I often feel like you can make a bigger impact and actually more Revenue longer term yeah and more

sustainably if you've got a better business model for that yeah for me for you because of your um your history of preaching I suppose yeah yeah The Mastermind Community style one would be the way right like your Instagram that you've got here there's already 6 800 strong people yeah like how do you bring them into a place where they can actually interact and be part of something yeah um and then how do you bring everyone else into that and build that fast yeah because there's like there's no reason to follow this content yeah it's just like oh it pops up and I feed cool interesting yeah but there's nothing for me to get invested into I'm not part of something you know like when people

are now watching the football right now right and they're watching their teams they're very invested very invisible they feel like that's their team yeah there's none of that yeah so why would I follow and get super invested and then why would I pay you money would the story have to be more engaging the story needs to be for you either they care about Josh yeah like they really care about your success which um could be a little hard for you to do no only because like your you know your dad's the pastor of the church like really what like what struggles do you have that you need people to care about yeah but like you know like I'm just being honest um but what if

but your followers do have struggles yeah and so they could care about their own struggles that you help and bring a community in to support right that's what church is anywhere right that's what you do already in the church so how do you do that digitally yeah and have a have a group of people that come together and build it themselves once you have a community that builds itself yeah then you don't you you get out of the way so you would say dive deep into certain themes and look into certain like needs I would try to find how do you facilitate interaction between the community daily can you do that on LinkedIn you can do that everywhere but you probably so on LinkedIn you're

it's a you've got to think of them different like Instagram LinkedIn Facebook Tick Tock at top of funnel people into a deeper Community yeah so as a community on Discord you know is it on YouTube like where is the community house that a matter right okay that's not the big thing okay those all those social channels are just top of funnel feeders to the main Community right and is there a platform for that community that main Community oh there's heaps of them out there if you want to find them okay okay but I mean you just give you just use Discord okay because it's the cheapest it's got some of the best utilities on it yeah okay or you would add them to a telegram

group or a group or something okay there's multiple ways you can get okay cool like and the purpose of that group is to nourish the the nourish the followers or nourish the people that are following year to be consistent or you know as possible and then how you monetize that group you can decide there's heaps of ways okay cool I mean you could just have events yeah right and you could just like we've got a client who does that for cheerleading yeah and they they literally own cheerleading in New Zealand and they've got an event in Hawaii in April and they've had pre-sales of three million dollars wow so well you know like once you have an audience yeah that is will do anything for

you and be part and believe in your your thing yeah correct I mean that has been the church for 2000 years 100 so how do you do the same thing how do you build your own sort of group of people around a topic that's not because you're going to differentiate it from church you're just going to use Faith to inform the things that you teach because yours is going to be some of it's it surely has to be um like something around business and Human Performance and um leading oneself right like it's got to be something especially development personal development right that's you 100 so how do you find these people like these 2018 to 30 year old young faith-based people yeah who are all

trying to who are going through their own Discovery yeah right okay and then how do you pull them into a room and have them all fully invested in each other right and then however you can monetize it any way you want I mean you can do the scammy and sell them of course yeah but like I think that's not the best way to do it content would be the backbone to building that brand yeah 100 that's all the type of funnel stuff so you put out heaps of content yeah you drive those followers down into something deeper yep hey if you enjoyed this come join this group of people that's free like don't make the community cost okay gotcha don't charge for the community but

what you want is a you want like you can't like you can't talk to everyone you want to on Tick Tock like we've got 220 something thousand followers now you can't just talk them right whenever you want you can try but if they don't care they're not going to see it but if they're part of a community that's actively participating yeah then you can just walk in put a post up and then they all see it they all want to be part of it yeah because they're actively part of the community right yeah sure so at that point how you monetize them is up to you how do you see the world of attention evolving in the in the marketing space right obviously the personal

Brands like if they're going to be more personal Brands coming into the space of the personal brand World more attention is going to be diverted what would you what would your advice be to somebody that wants it you know create their personal brand and number two somebody that already has an existing brand then it's going to be competing for attention uh my advice would be that if you're doing the activity you need to do don't worry because no one else's okay no one does it that's good feedback yep I'll take the lady no one does it no one tries no one tries to build a personal brand and so if you are then do you think that would be the act of active thing going

forward or do you think there'll be a shift in in the way people look at things soon so take Instagram as an example yeah okay so when Instagram and Facebook came in strong yeah before that no little local um you know cookie Baker at the markets head of Facebook had a way of marketing themselves except going to the markets yeah correct and then Facebook and Instagram came along and those who were really good at making content blew up and then they became National Brands yeah right have been all over the world you know how many people are still trying to do that and suck at it and get nowhere there's heaps of them there's millions of Facebook pages right going yeah where yeah so personal

Brands will be the same I mean personal brands have been around for a long time it's just that it's become more accessible to do it yes and so yes there's always going to be those who do it well and those who do it poorly right and so you still have the same distribution what would you say is the difference between the ones that do it poorly and do it really well do you think it's uh I wouldn't say it's one difference so one is the first is consistency always like people don't stick at stuff yeah consistency on the platform or consistency whatever a message platform okay content yeah what do you actually do yeah like that's probably hurts you the most over the last three

years is changing things yeah because it's not like every time I saw you for a little while it's like another thing going on right in it but you're young so it's different but building a personal brand that's really hard when you're consistently changing so consistency then in terms of the content the quality of the creative yep the quality of the content you put out as always yeah always big and it doesn't mean that you need to have good content to start with yeah it just means you need to keep working towards better content okay yeah makes sense because too many people are like all right they won't start because it's not perfect yeah but just get it going yeah and then you'll get better like

our contents you look at the stuff I first ever put out on my Duncan picture stuff it's just complete huge massive difference yeah um and then in terms of the third one the third one probably supports the other two is what is that money like how are you going to get paid yeah because if you've just done it for no reason then it gets very unsustainable like unfortunately money just makes the world go around still yeah like it will always be the case yeah because I think it's not gonna change so monetize the [ __ ] out of it yeah and just try to find the best way to do that yeah yeah if you think about it all right like it's good that's how you do

it make good content put it out all the time and then make money from it which then feeds back into you being able to put out more content consistently yeah and it's just a bit I mean that's all we've done and also recently behind Sean like well it was just to make more like when we hired Shan we didn't really need her role but we knew it was worth the investment to make more and better content we're like we didn't know how to do video very well so we needed to do more videos so we needed someone to help us support that side of things which then Sean coming and doing more video for me but then we started doing some for a couple clients

they're already on board to give them a crack and see how we could do it which then gave us the confidence to go hire a whole bunch more videographers do more stuff because it was selling that as a package so it's just this virtuous cycle way would you say stay on one platform or diversify your platform with me like with average reach or would you go what are you selling you know that's the thing like what are you monetizing okay because everybody there's a lot of people that will say hey let's go to the next Shiny Toy or the next shiny platform like tick tock that's why it took me three years to go to tick tock yeah I was telling you from day one

I was like get into Tick Tock and I think you took your time but I took my time to do it properly like you did it strategically Brian Melton was the same all the time right he was always like you know you should be and Tick Tock look at the views on me I was like I'll get there when I'm ready yeah and then it just so happened that I like we got there got the right person blew up yeah and then just like wiped the floor with everyone on it yeah um that was hard like that was like we'd learned a lot it wasn't just that Tick Tock was right we had learned a lot as a team as well great so all of

those things came together to work together then strategy wise we had the strategy then we just got the right resource who could execute that strategy for us yeah and then what's your goal for tick tock from the monetization standpoint that's already monetizing oh wow okay yeah we've already got clients from it okay yeah so that was never the strategy the strategy you've never sponsored it Addy oh we did some tests on one to see what would happen um it was really [ __ ] it was really sure um do you have login sales now logins oh you do um if you can log into tears Tick Tock I'll show you there that's really terrible and you've got you've got some response from that from Market feedback okay

oh we got some response we've got some data from it too but we just haven't had time to go forward now we've got we've literally signed we've got like I don't know seven clients yeah oh we've got a plan for New Zealand ah no no we what we're thinking we can't even put this online this is what we're gonna do [ __ ] you we're gonna go make a response to Ryanair Asia New Zealand wow and just make it our own channel wow and then make that channel blow up yeah and then force your New Zealand to buy it from us [Laughter] and you get a few hundred thousand people I think they have zero folders yeah I can show it on here you can always put

it on here to do it yourself because dumb young people willing to do the work that you don't want to do from that uh from a click through an All-Star and all that sort of stuff like yeah I don't know little to nothing but we just wanted to see what would how would people react to something like that um 2.7 seconds was our average watch time wow yeah which is low real low so um it taught us a little bit there because you know we're riding on the high of like Joni being the main character of our story yeah like there's got to be some people here who know her so they'll see her and at least watch a little bit yeah and she's rappling

off like this like she doesn't stop so we thought that at least watch it yeah they still sponsored go right past I think I think there's a there's a big one when it comes to Young creatives and them launching up their brand and doing what they need to do I think Perfection is the biggest obstacle right for sure like you've rammed on about this for a long time yeah um it's that stigma of yeah I need to be perfect or I need to like wait for the right conditions to start my brand like there's an element of like shame you know like hey I don't feel good enough about myself until you do this you know like how do you overcome that oh like what

would you say to a young creative that has a potential um but just just does nothing about it so 99 times out of 100 that person will only be able to do to get over that on their own doesn't matter what you say to them okay and but those one out of hundreds um all you can possibly say to them is like put it out and learn from it that's all you can do there's nothing else you can tell that person yeah because like that is the main reason why some people become childhood Emilia right because if we could all just get over it yeah then we would all put out lots of content and then not one person could race at the top because

there'd just be too much content yeah right and we'd all get better at it and we'll do it yeah so that's just the way humans are it'll always be that way most people won't be able to wow they just won't be able to be consistent enough and putting out I mean Sean's a good example Sean's real good at making the videos that she makes like her stuff that she puts out is really good for her sweet home stuff okay but her standards so high that she will never put out the quantity that's needed to make sweet home blow up fast it could blow up on long-term scale don't get me wrong like it can it will it probably will she keeps at it but in

a short-term scale it just won't because like people creatives have like they need to put it you need that's how the platforms work you need to be out consistent and put Lots out to get it there yeah but their level of perfection is too high they don't need to be able to and even the concept of perfection is subjective you know what I mean like what's perfect to me is different to what's perfect to you right and I think I I've worked with some creatives and they would never put work out they would never get their brand up and really to be honest the success of today people that have built personal brands have done it five years ago they've started sewing seeds five years

ago so the way I look at it is if in the next five years if I really want to blow up I've got to do the hard yards now you know I think that's the mindset think about this what do you want to blow up doing yeah because the thing we just went on about before is one option but like is it really the option you want who knows because actually if it is like what you've actually just said is go start a church yeah because that's actually the better way it's a proven model you're the son of the pastor go do your own church yeah it'll work yeah yeah that's actually the best way to monetize it right go start your own church yeah

that's actually the right the traditional way yeah yeah but but you can use it's a traditional business model or a traditional model yeah with modern day marketing behind it right so you can blow up a church to be massive yeah um to build that as big as possible rather than like the old way which was just I'm the local church so you come to the local church right and you get the local footprint sort of coming to you and that sort of expands as families move in there yeah but that's that's really that one so what you really need to do is figure out what's the monetization point of view and start there so it was like me when I started this business yeah was

always like I knew that I wanted to sell some form of um knowledge around this platform yeah I just didn't know I need I need to find out exactly what on what you're saying is how did he come from a place of chaos to Clarity yeah sales okay just sell [ __ ] you just wanted to be a Salesman no I just wanted to make money okay and so I sold lots of shirts and then I got and then as I sold something can hit deliver it I had to figure out like is this really what I want to do like I built a full course of this stuff and then the moment I built it I was like I never want to sell this right this

is so scammy yeah okay I've spent a summer building that I still have it the the first attention seeker iterative right yeah yeah I remember that was like two thousand dollars or something yeah I would buy it no no no no but like I still think what was it was it like a video course or something it's literally how we do the things we do okay so we're going to do that again this summer I'm going to do it yeah but I'm not going to sell it I'm gonna put on YouTube and give it away free right okay cool um there's a top funnel thing yeah but like because a lot of people say this they're like oh yeah like it's still working up in

time but like it's only been three years that I've been in business but your year-on-year growth is crazy yeah but that's because I always looked at monetization of it you're about 100 growth every year eh would you say uh yep that's unheard of like nah it's not is it if you look at like okay deloitte's fast 40 whatever that's called they're like three four hundred percent okay yeah for service based business is pretty fast okay it's not the fastest right um for uh it but we are fast when you look at it that we're service based business with no investment but let me just add to that your agency versus other agencies is that your story is far more prominent in your long-term strategy than

it is like with the likes of the ones in ponsonby or in the city you know those big agency that nobody knows of yeah yeah you know what I mean that's intentional right oh [ __ ] it yeah okay it's the only way to sell it or the only way I could grow it the biggest brand possible yeah so I the goal was always to meet my brand the biggest possible as I flipped no okay still the same still same okay the monetization was always first though because the monetization pays for the growth of my brain correct so I have to make sure I'm making money and then I have to make sure that the brand comes first and then every and then as that grows I

can bring in more Brands so like attention Seekers coming in now the other guys in the team and as we grow like I'll send to you a day right like our big hero dashes go at the moment is 10 billion followers in the next 10 years that's huge that's huge massive right so being able to capture all of that is about I still like you can only do that if you can pay for it so the money comes to us always money comes first so like for you like what you just said is like over the next five years I've got the space and why not just do it in a year that's interesting that's a challenge man our first year of business was 390.

390 Grand wow and then yeah we doubled that to like 890 900 something like that over a million yeah this year we'll do like 1.5 figure out the clarity and the content the creatives and then just figure out your audience get clear on what you want to sell and start selling it just start selling it straight away okay just start selling it suck it up I should just sell personal development course today create a framework of how to be your best self yep people do it all the time yeah yeah I need to do that maybe I should try it that way just do it just sell it it doesn't matter what you settle for just sell it give me an example you just say

hey this is purchase go to this link and sit by the course no no no no no sell privately also always sell a person don't don't don't [ __ ] do click funnels yeah sure man don't be Ryan Melton yes Ryan I told you don't be [ __ ] around Mountain don't use click funnels okay Market publicly sell privately okay yeah so don't sell anymore so you're saying start DMS or initiate conversations or are you support our content that that make them want to spend time with you yeah exactly yeah yeah exactly it's good I like that and then solve their problems and then ask some questions how do you do that in a scalable way let's just say you have 50 inquiries do you just have somebody sitting

on the LinkedIn oh the scalable way to do this hire more people oh okay cool see yeah va's no just hire good sales people okay yeah I could tell people underneath you but at the moment I can handle how do you determine what to charge this is a good good question for those younger what can you ask in the mirror confidently every time I put prices up for a self-esteem question to be honest too every time the way you value yourself is is going to be determined or seen through your price you could say you're worth ten thousand dollars you know but you have to believe it like you said yeah 100 so a year ago a year and a bit ago we didn't charge

setup fee and and since then I've charged 15 grand 10 grand for one setup and a year and a bit ago we didn't we charge zero I didn't real like we needed to I realized I'd priced it wrong but would you know what your what your client um the the time it takes to get a claim for you it's different I had one client they just signed in after a thousand days yep like literally 1 000 days on the day and then other people who I meet and the next day they pay me money okay yeah so it's a case by case basis yeah makes sense yeah all right okay top of the hour I've got to finish I think I've got a call at

three oh I know I've got Jordan coming um hey thanks man hey thanks for coming on I appreciate you talking about I think stuff like that yeah it's a good thing I figured out the blueprint yeah yeah once it once he sorted out yeah watch part two once you've figured this out and you come back and tell us something yeah essentially damn once you figure it out and you start selling it then we'll come back and we'll rip the model apart yeah that'll be good let's do it that'd be good okay cool that's that's quite value-adding yeah all right we're done cool cool man thank you